Mr. Jenner. All right, proceed and describe that to us.
Mr. Oswald. Still my contact with him was limited, but he did appear to be drawn within himself more than he had been prior, and I do not know of any friends that he had at that particular time.
One factor of course would be that he had moved quite frequently or a number of times during this period.
Mr. Jenner. Apart from the reason, for the moment, I seek to draw from you your personal reaction as to whether he had become more retiring and that you had actually noticed that difference in him?
Mr. Oswald. Well, to me, sir, he had become or appeared to become more drawn into himself to the extent that I noticed that he wanted to read more, and of course when he wanted to read he wanted to be by himself. However, to me personally at that time when we were together, if he did not wish to read, he seemed and appeared to be as he was prior to 1952, sir.
Mr. Jenner. Did that state of mind or his action, did you notice that that persisted when he returned from Russia?
Was he still of that retiring nature?
Mr. Oswald. No, sir; he was not. I felt that he was more of a gregarious type person that wanted to mix with people and wanted to talk to people.
Mr. Jenner. After he left your home and took residence with your mother and thereafter in various places in Fort Worth, did he seek you out?
Mr. Oswald. Yes, sir. He called me on a number of occasions at my office.
Mr. Jenner. Did he come by your home and visit you voluntarily without invitation?
Mr. Oswald. I do not recall of any time, sir. I usually was talking to him on the telephone quite frequently during the period that he had moved out of my mother's apartment into their own duplex, to the extent that I always told him that if he would like to come out any time just to give me a ring and I would gladly pick them up and bring them out to the house and return them to their home.
Mr. Jenner. Did he do so?
Mr. Oswald. No, sir; he did not.
Mr. Dulles. There has been some testimony here before the Commission to the general effect that in the latter period he broke pretty much away with some of the Russian group of friends in Dallas that Marina had developed or liked to be with, and that is because she could talk Russian. Did you see anything of that, and can you throw any further light on that?
Mr. Oswald. No, sir; I did not. I was aware or had become aware of this group or some other group of the Russian-speaking population in Dallas, and I was aware of Mr. Gregory in Fort Worth, Tex., who had come to my house before Lee and Marina had moved out, to speak in the Russian language to Marina and to Lee. I was not aware that—I was aware that he was talking with and becoming acquainted with this group of persons, and I was not aware of the fact that he was withdrawing from this group of people.
Mr. Dulles. Did you know anything about his relations with a certain man named De Mohrenschildt?
Mr. Oswald. No, sir; I did not.
Mr. Jenner. Is the name familiar to you?
Mr. Oswald. No, sir; it is not.
Mr. McKenzie. Off the record.
(Discussion off the record.)
Mr. McKenzie. Mr. Dulles, who is the Chairman of the session today, has asked Mr. Oswald if he knows or has heard of a man by the name of De Mohrenschildt. Robert Oswald's answer I believe is reflected on the record that he did not know Mr. De Mohrenschildt. I have stated off the record to Mr. Dulles and to Mr. Jenner that I know George De Mohrenschildt.
I became acquainted with George De Mohrenschildt in this manner. Shortly after the law was passed in Texas that we could have women jurors——
Mr. Jenner. Could you fix that time?
Mr. McKenzie. No, I cannot, but it has been within the last five years. I would say. But shortly after the law was passed that we could have women jurors sitting in our courts, my wife happened to be on a jury in Dallas, Texas, in one of our district courts. Sitting on that same jury with my wife, Sally McKenzie was a man by the name of George De Mohrenschildt. As a result of her jury experience in the trial of this case, in which he was a juror, I met George De Mohrenschildt. I have since come to know him briefly, and in no way intimately.
George De Mohrenschildt at one time was married to a lady from Pennsylvania by the name of Wynne Sharples. They were subsequently divorced in Dallas. Wynne Sharples is an M.D. by profession. She comes from a well-known Pennsylvania family, and her father has been engaged in the oil business under the name of Sharples Oil Company.
Wynne Sharples, following her divorce from George De Mohrenschildt, remarried and married another M.D.
Mr. Jenner. What is her married name?
Mr. McKenzie. I do not recall her married name, but I do believe that she and her then husband, and I presume her present husband, the doctor that she married, were engaged in medical research at some hospital in Philadelphia or Baltimore, looking to the cause and a cure of a children's ailment of a very serious nature, and I believe it was connected with some blood type ailment.
Mr. Jenner. Leukemia?
Mr. McKenzie. No, it was not leukemia. There was an article on Wynne Sharples in one of the magazine supplements of either the Dallas Times-Herald or the Dallas Morning News, within the past five years.
George De Mohrenschildt has subsequently remarried, and some time within the past two years there was an article on George De Mohrenschildt in one of the Dallas daily newspapers, telling of a trip that he and his new bride were going to take through Mexico and Central America walking. In other words, they were going to walk from Dallas or the Mexican-United States border through Mexico and through Central America. It is my understanding that such a trip was taken, and that George De Mohrenschildt has since that time returned to Dallas, Tex. In fact, I have seen him in Dallas, Tex., within the past 7 months.
I do not know of any relationship between George De Mohrenschildt and Marina Oswald or Lee Harvey Oswald, nor have I ever heard of any.
Mr. Jenner. Would you describe George De Mohrenschildt physically, his physical appearance, the one you have in mind?
Mr. McKenzie. The man that I know is a large man, approximately six foot one to three inches. He would probably weigh 205 to maybe 215 pounds.
Mr. Jenner. Age?
Mr. McKenzie. He appears to be between 45 and 50 or 51 or 52. He has got a dark complexion, and I would say a typically foreign expression or foreign look to him, from the standpoint of being either a Russian or of the Slavic races.
Mr. Jenner. Have you ever spoken with him, to give us your impression of whether he has a foreign inflection in his speech?
Mr. McKenzie. He does have a foreign inflection in his speech, and I have heard, I do not know this to be true, but I have heard that Mr. De Mohrenschildt has quite a way with the ladies.
Mr. Jenner. All right, thanks.
Mr. Dulles. Thank you very much.
Mr. Jenner. Mr. Oswald, I have asked
