Martin. No, my wife did.
Mr. Redlich. Do you recall the nature of the conversations between your wife and Mrs. Paine as reported to you?
Mr. Martin. Well, let's see, she called and asked for Marina or asked to get in touch with Marina. My wife gave me the number and I guess I called her back.
Mr. Redlich. You called Mrs. Paine back?
Mr. Martin. A day or two later, yes.
Mr. Redlich. What did you say to her?
Mr. Martin. I told her that under the present circumstances she just didn't want to see anybody, and also the security on her didn't permit her to go out too far. That we could possibly arrange a meeting at some middle point later on.
Mr. Redlich. Was Marina free to see anyone she wanted to see?
Mr. Martin. Yes.
Mr. Redlich. And the reason she didn't see Mrs. Paine was because she didn't want to see Mrs. Paine?
Mr. Martin. Yes. I asked her several times to call her, at least call Mrs. Paine and tell her she didn't want to see her, and she just shrugged her shoulders and said she didn't want to talk to her.
Mr. Redlich. Did Marina ever tell you why she didn't want to talk to her?
Mr. Martin. She said something about Mrs. Paine talking too much, and she didn't like Mrs. Paine's children.
Mr. Redlich. Were you aware at the time that Marina had lived with Mrs. Paine?
Mr. Martin. Yes.
Mr. Redlich. Were you aware at the time that Mrs. Paine had taken the Oswald family to New Orleans and had——
Mr. Martin. Yes.
Mr. Redlich. Gone to New Orleans and brought them back to Irving, Tex.?
Mr. Martin. Yes, that is why I felt she owed Mrs. Paine something.
Mr. Redlich. What was Marina's attitude toward your comments?
Mr. Martin. She just didn't want to talk to her.
Mr. Redlich. Did you yourself ever meet Mrs. Paine?
Mr. Martin. Yes.
Mr. Redlich. Would you describe that meeting?
Mr. Martin. Well, the first time I met her was we went over to the Paine's house to pick up some of Marina's belongings.
Mr. Redlich. Who is "we"?
Mr. Martin. John Thorne and I.
Mr. Redlich. Do you recall about when this was?
Mr. Martin. I guess it was about a week after she had moved in, maybe shorter, maybe sooner than that. There was not much said at all at that meeting. Then when she came out to the house she talked at length, but it was——
Mr. Redlich. There is another occasion when you say she came?
Mr. Martin. When she came to my house.
Mr. Redlich. That was the same occasion that you referred to earlier when she came to pick up a package?
Mr. Martin. To deliver a package.
Mr. Redlich. To deliver a package, I am sorry. Could you relate what happened at that time?
Mr. Martin. I was quite distracted by the children. It was rather a stiff meeting or conversation.
Representative Ford. This was the meeting at Mrs. Paine's house?
Mr. Martin. No, my house.
Representative Ford. Your house?
Mr. Martin. Mrs. Paine brought, I think, a package and some food, cookies, things like that, for Marina, and——
Mr. Dulles. Those are from Mrs. Paine to Marina, but the package was a third——
Mr. Martin. The package came through the mail.
Mr. Dulles. That you understand, but the cookies came from Mrs. Paine.
Mr. Martin. Yes.
I believe she brought some toys for the children. What the toys were, I don't recall. Her children were running back and forth through the living room making quite a bit of noise.
Mr. Dulles. Mrs. Paine's children?
Mr. Martin. Yes. And I wasn't really paying too much attention to what she was saying. I was wanting her to leave. I didn't ask her to leave but I wasn't saying much to foster the conversation. Then she left in, I guess, 15 minutes.
Mr. Redlich. What did Mrs. Paine say to you?
Mr. Martin. Oh, boy——
Mr. Dulles. Was she disturbed, I mean was she annoyed, visibly annoyed, that Marina wouldn't see her. She didn't know Marina was in the house, I realize that.
Mr. Martin. She didn't know Marina was in the house. I am certain she didn't.
Mr. Redlich. You mean her children were running around the house though, weren't they?
Mr. Martin. Her children were running in the living room and dining room.
Mr. Dulles. But not into the den?
Mr. Martin. But not into the den and kitchen.
Representative Ford. Do you have a door on the den so you can close the den off?
Mr. Martin. Yes. She talked mostly about generalities and she would like to see Marina to make sure she is well taken care of, and so on. She was concerned about her. And she came back after that time, she came back once more. I wasn't there. My wife answered the door and didn't invite her in.
Mr. Dulles. How long a trip is it from your house to Mrs. Paine's, roughly, a few miles?
Mr. Martin. No, a good 20 miles.
Mr. Dulles. A good 20 miles?
Mr. Martin. Because it is 30 miles out to the Inn, and she lives about 8 or 10 miles toward me from the Inn, so it is about 20 miles.
Mr. Redlich. Your wife did not invite Mrs. Paine into the house at that time?
Mr. Martin. No.
Mr. Redlich. Was this at Marina's urging?
Mr. Martin. Yes. Mrs. Paine was quite upset at that—that is what Wanda said, she looked upset at that time.
Representative Ford. On this occasion, did Mrs. Paine know Marina was in the house?
Mr. Martin. No, I don't believe so.
Mr. Dulles. Did she ask where she was, specifically?
Mr.
